I'm not usually too blunt but... there is no way that a candle fundraiser is going to outperform a fall catalog or cookie dough sale if they are properly run. Candles are not more in demand than a catalog or food items so I am pretty confused by your statement.

I have to disagree. You need to sell items that people want. Soy candles sell....we have raised thousands and used Soy Sensations out of Georgia. I think people are tired of cookie dough, chocolate and wrapping paper...

I like what middle age dad said here. More than just price, offering value is the key. Keeping prices in line is certainly a big component of that. There are a lot of instances where premium priced items are sold and folks don't complain about it but there are less buyers. By keeping prices low, more folks are willing to buy. It's a balancing act no doubt.

Here are my two bits on this subject. I was at a district meeting and a fellow PTO person from another school showed me the catalog they chose to sell next fall. After looking at it, I asked her, "don't you think the prices are really high?" She replied yes, but the company was going to give them some free books and rebate them 2% of the invoice. I also asked her if she used this company last year and if so, how did they do. Of course, the answer was yes, and the sale was horrible last year. So why work with this overpriced company? Free books and the promise of some dumb rebate.

As long as schools sell a box of candy for $11 and $9.00-$10 for a roll of gift wrap. product sales are going to continue to go down. That is a fact. If it is not true, why are so many suppliers to the industry and the actual companies that call on your school out of business? People in your community are not stupid. And now, please buy cookie dough which is a smaller amount than two years ago for $15. Boy, that is a great deal. It's cookie dough and it does not come in a golden container.

There is hope out there. I saw one catalog where all the gift wrap was $7.00. I also saw cookie dough (three pounds) being sold for $10 and $11. One company sent me a packet and noted that one of their schools sold almost 1,000 more cookie dough items than the previous year increasing from 750 items to almost 1,800 items! Why the increase? The school sold it for $11, not $15 as the year before. Their community appreciated it and they actually netted more profits. Too bad there is not more sanity out there!

Wow. PTOMoMindy. I am afraid I ruffled some feathers; and I apologize. First and foremost, I did not nor do not want to turn this into an argument. I could argue my points all day long, and for our community here where poverty levels are rising rapidly here they may be spot on, while in your community they may differ because of parent participation, etc.

So it is absolutely fruitless to turn this into an argument. The fact remains in business -- and PTAs are a business -- you must consider your customer, or in this case your business partners: the family.

In regards cheap junk. Regardless where it is made, this is again going to be subjective, depending on what one is used to and how one defines quality. Again, I'm not hear to argue.

About forcing kids to sell when they don't want to: No one is forcing anyone. If a kid doesn't want to, he/she doesn't have to. There will always be pros and cons to this side of it, just like anything in life. Interestingly enough there was a great article the other day in a paper here in Washington that talked about the social benefits of kids doing fundraising; of kids going out and working for something. Pros and Cons need to be considered though for the certain group, area, product, goal, etc.

As for safety cards, I'm not pitching this as much as I was proving a point that success in this economy is largely dependent on what need you can fulfill among families that do not have extra money to spend on candy bars, wrapping paper, etc.

Again, this may depend on the levels of wealth in your area compared to mine.

That said, you ask the question why anyone would buy what they can get on the internet for free. Three points to answer this question. One, I'd be happy to send you images of our cards and you can answer that for yourself. Two, they'd buy it and they do buy it (we've already done fundraisers) for the same reason they buy wrapping paper and coupons -- because they want to support the cause. Three, it fills a need. Yes, they can get this information for free online. But will they? and how long will it take to gather it? At the same time, the information they get online is often old, from unreliable sources, not consolidated, and not in a manner that makes retention and teaching children easy. Our cards cover everything from CPR to First Aid for Choking, to Helping Kids know what to do in various emergencies, how to call 911, etc, etc. They deal with strangers, drugs, peer pressure, bike safety, internet safety, and so on and on and on.

As a parent, we all know these things need to be taught. But how often do we teach it; and even then how well do we teach it.

2200 kids are reported missing each day. Kids set 35,000 fires every year. Most bike-related fatalities occur within one mile of the child's home. Where CPR can save a life, only 6.4% of the victims survive because CPR is not performed properly or at all. Our cards are designed to reverse these trends. They can be put on the fridge or walls. They come in booklets for teaching. And they come with wallet/purse sized cards to carry with you at all times.

Yes, we can go on the internet, but what if it is not available? What if we do not have time to go on the internet when someone's life is in danger? What if we just keep putting it off like the majority of parents -- not because we don't care, but because we don't think an accident will happen to us or because we are so very, very busy.

I would hate to find myself in an emergency situation or worse have my kids in such a situation unprepared because I told myself I could always look it up for free.

You cannot put a price on safety. But that does not mean the best way to achieve familial safety or anything is always free. We try our best to put an affordable price on safety to make these cards available to the community, support our schools, and come away with just enough to cover our costs and the time needed to continually develop new cards.

Again, my simply perhaps overlooked point was this: in all of our efforts, in the chaos of fundraising, and seeking to support our families, schools, sports, whatever, we must not lose sight of the human factor here. We must work together. That is it.

My job is to support my family and provide for my child's education, which I do -- sometimes with my wallet, but more often than not by teaching correct principles and common courtesy in my home.

And with that I humbly bow out of this conversation.

Sincerely,

Arthur Lee

I would like to address some of Arthur's comments...first of all, in these economic times, our PTOs and PTAs are being asked to contribute monies towards items within the classrooms, that they haven't had to do in the past. Paper, school supplies, batteries for clocks, on and on. As a PTO, our school has to forget about the "frivolous" things and help with day to day expenses as I'm sure most have to do.

So, that being said, our PTO's have to look for fundraisers that #1 show consistency in yearly sales and provide a good profit with NO strings attached #2 offer products that are of value and good quality #3 and most importantly, do NOT force our kids to sell if they don't want to. The data still shows that doing high quality catalog sales (like we do at our school, and have consistenly for 5 years with Innsbrook) and perhaps a community focused family event are all schools should be doing in the fundraising departments. LIMIT THE WHITE NOISE BY THROWING EVERY FUNDRAISING PIDDLY THING AT PARENTS....DINING AT RESTAURANTS FOR WHAT? $100 IN PROFIT? COME ON!!!

Have you BEEN to Target or WalMart lately? Where are MOST items made? China or overseas....are toys good quality? What is your definition of good quality? There is a HUGE difference when it comes to wrapping paper quality among companies and purchasing it at the dollar store/target/wherever. You have to see it first hand to know what I mean...you can't just make claims.

As far as the cards you developed...good for you, for coming up with them, but why would I want to PAY for information that I can get FREE on the internet? Doesn't make sense to me...I wouldn't buy them.

In general, people who run PTO/PTA's are not business peopole....they are moms who often think they know what they are doing and don't. We are lucky at our school, that we have parents that come to meetings, analyze situations and make informed decisions...I think that' s why we always have plenty of money.

Anyway, some things to think about